'Despite being a non-woman, Real Beauty got me thinking'

David Mayo Vice-president, Ogilvy & Mather Advertising Asia-Pacific

In a sentence, define integration.

Sounds obvious, but 'seamlessness' — applying the right tools for the right job when it comes to solving clients' marketing problems. Making sure that you say the right thing at the right time to the right person. Using skills, not departments. Focusing on the work first, not worrying about the revenue.

What needs to happen before an agency can genuinely describe itself as integrated?

Deep knowledge in the specialist skills and breadth of management skills to bring them together. You must have respect for each other — and know and like each other — it is not something that happens just because you bought a specialist company last week, which is what so many people that come to Asia tend to do (or even those already here to gain mass).

 

Many clients, particularly in Asia, are far from integrated themselves. So what's all the fuss about?

This is simply not true. Much has changed in the past five years. Look at Motorola and the way Ogilvy is set up to service that brand. Of Ogilvy's top 30 clients, half of them use three or more disciplines.

Was media unbundling a mistake?

It was all part of the evolution of the communications industry. Many progressive things have happened as a result: clients have become more aware of where their money is spent, so creative agencies have become more accountable. This has led creative agencies to dig deeper for better ideas, which has driven them back towards media re-integration.

Are agencies obsessed with big ideas that work across channels?

Agencies should certainly be obsessed with big ideas or they aren't doing their job. And a big idea is always going to be an idea capable of working across channels. The definition may have changed to reflect a changing media environment, but the task is always to ensure that the idea comes first.

What's the best integrated campaign ever created?
 
In 2002, BMW created a revolution where content, product, creativity and media all conspired in bmwfilms.com, but the hermaphrodyte Dove 'Real beauty' campaign is arguably at the pinnacle right now. The work combines scale with simplicity, media with message and an unwavering focus on a current and simple insight where the brand and its consumers meet.

 

Phil Brett Chairman, TBWA\Group Singapore

In a sentence, define integration.

Integration has little to do with execution — it's about putting a strategy together, having a pure thought with none or all channels in mind. Too many campaigns are defined by execution, which should come later.

 

What needs to happen before an agency can genuinely describe itself as integrated?

The most important thing is to have people who get along and see the world in the same way. You should never force-fit companies that don't share the same outlook. All the stupid, nonsensical barriers that belie a sense of equality should be removed. If the guy who does the 30-second spots is the arbiter of the way things are run, the whole thing just won't work.

 

Many clients, particularly in Asia, are far from integrated themselves. So what's all the fuss about?

Companies in Asia are smaller, nimbler and demand more value from campaigns. Sometimes, advertising is the last thing they think about, and circumstances provoke clients to see channels in a different way. We have to make sure that the brand and the customer relationship is actively managed, rather than just executed.

Was media unbundling a mistake?

Yes and no. It wasn't always done for the best reasons. There are elements of media that could be more closely aligned to creative agencies — those that bring real insights and smart media rather than scale, exemplified by the Nakeds and the PHDs of the world. If an agency is making money from certain types of media, there'll be a conflict of interests.

Are agencies obsessed with big ideas that work across channels?

Often agencies will come up with a euphemism for a big idea, rather than something that genuinely works across channels. Most agencies still talk about ideas in terms of an advertising proposition. Finding a consumer proposition that reaches them across touch points is what integration is all about.

 

What's the best integrated campaign ever created?
 
Dove. Despite being a non-consumer and a non-woman, the 'Real beauty' campaign got me thinking. Here is a campaign that is about the message — not any one channel in particular, nor the positioning. It hasn't had people pour over it creatively, but it's a brilliantly-constructed campaign.